Pentecostal Lies
August 12th, 2008 by Carl Thomas.I have a buddy that pastors a church in a pentecostal denomination but his services are markedly un-pentecostal. I don’t have a problem with that. Don’t get me wrong, I firmly believe that every believer needs the baptism of the Holy Ghost and that the evidence of this baptism does not end with babbling.
But my friend is trying to get folks “far from God” close to God. He states this as his purpose, challenges his congregation to get involved in that purpose and prays that God would manifest more of it in his congregation. Great aspiration. Now, if he were to declare that he is seeing scores coming to repentance it would be a lie.
He has seen folks get restored to the faith. He has seen the Holy Ghost drawing some back to God and he sees people who never went to a non-Catholic church get plugged in to a true Christian church for the first time. And that is the truth about what is happening. He tells me about what God has placed in his heart and it has not manifested. He knows it, I know it, his congregation knows it, and he does not try to convince them of anything else. It has not come yet so he and his congregation pray for the fulfillment of the promise.
It is not the absence of loud tongues in service that separates him from most pentecostal churches. The fact that he does not lie to himself and his congregation about what God is doing is what makes his church different than most pentecostal churches.
Note to Spirit-filled churches: Telling the truth is not the absence of faith, it is keeping from sin.
Just because sister Betsy jerks when she prays and brother Earl runs around praying in tongues does not make your church in revival. Because someone got “refreshed” last month does not mean you are in Pentecost. And an outpouring is not determined by how long you can drag out every worship song.
When real revival hits you don’t need to hype anyone about it. Everyone can tell.
Leaders, speak the truth. It is far greater to speak against the denominations line with integrity than keep the denominations declarations through lieing. Here is what I would love to hear from your pulpits:
- It is my belief that we can do more to affect this city through orderly services with sound teaching than to allow people to manifest the Holy Spirit in disorderly ways. We make room for that in other places but on Sunday morning we come to sing and hear the preached Word. instead of “We are going to allow the Holy Spirit to do whatever He wants.” Then rush every person who makes a noise out the side door.
- We have not grown much but we have a core group of faithful people and we are praying that we can be used to minister to this area. instead of “God is raising up faithful men and women for the end time harvest.”
- I love how passionate we are in worship but we have to figure how to get some of the folks out there passionate about God. instead of “When the Spirit of the Lord comes we worship like David did. If it bothers you to worship you need to find another church. We are gonna worship till the Spirit is done.”
- We have not seen the manifestation of an outpouring here yet but I know God is in these meetings and I am eagerly awaiting when He pours out in this congregation. instead of “This is revival! The anointing is being poured out. The religious can’t recognize a move of God.”
The religious often can’t recognize a move of God. But they can almost always recognize baseless hype. The truth is that what we are experiencing is not only far less than Pentecost, it is less than Azusa, Kentucky, Wales, and countless others. To lie and say we are in the fullness of revival is deception. Let’s pray that truthfulness will be embraced so we can earnestly sing,
Look down and see this waiting host
And send the promised Holy Ghost
We need another Pentecost, Send the fire today
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Yes and amen!!
I recently left a “river” church because they got drawn into the “hype” surrounding Lakeland, and were claiming numerous healings and miracles, even claims of leg lengthening! Now I don’t doubt for a minute those things do and have happened, and I’m not trying to “diss” Lakeland in any way, God was there and moving…people were changed and healed and touched…but a true move of God doesn’t need to be hyped up or copycatted.
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Man, I love it when you speak the truth. God bless.
BTW, did you get the comment E-mail notifications up and running yet?
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You want reality, which is so refreshing.
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“The Truth Shall Set You Free”
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@Alycia - The fact that we have to qualify our support should tell us something.
@Steve - Thanks, and no. To be honest . . .I have not even looked into it.
@don - thanks for the comment
@Ley - The freedom in this case comes from not having to “produce” something. The bible says fruit comes from God. If the HOly Ghost is not manifesting in my meetings I need to seek God with humility and find out why. By lieing and saying that something is happening that clearly is not happening, not only do I distort the truth, but I rob me and my congregation of a genuine experience.
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Carl–you’re right,and I wish I didn’t feel the need to “qualify” my support, but now I find myself having mixed feelings…I personally was blessed by it, as were many others, but the hype left a bad taste behind.
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Carl — I loved this post. Keep striking that note even if you feel like you’re doing it all alone. This is the sound of a new generation who is tired of hype and longing for God.
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The Lakeland problems serves as a warning to all of us who genuinely want to sovereign move of the Holy Ghost:
1.It’s not how you start, it’s how you finish…
2.We can either humble ourselves before the Lord….or He will do it for us!
3. If things cannot be verified completely, keep our mouths shut!
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Carl, it would be good if you could start a discussion about Lakeland and what’s going on with Todd. I just read the Charisma editorial and I detect a witch hunt brewing. Even if Todd is having marital issues, it doesn’t necessarily discount the revival or his anointing even, but I can see people starting to jump on the bandwagon already, yelling “false prophet”, etc.
From what I know, Todd and his wife are separated, has he said that his marriage is ending? Even if there is need of genuine repentance and humility leading toward restoration, that’s no excuse for people to turn on Todd in this vulnerable time. But wouldn’t that be just like the church?
I know that it is a serious issue, and does point to character issues (sin) that must be dealt with. What are your thoughts?
Then again, if you don’t want to talk about it (I can understand if you wouldn’t), feel free to delete this post.
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@matt - It disturbs me how some who call themselves Christians are almost gleeful over Todd’s recent problems. Patricia King just put out a video and she clearly said what is happening is sin. I can’t tell you how happy that made me. To see people in charismatic Christianity demand more from our leaders is refreshing.
I definitely won’t be discussing any issues Todd is having because I don’t know the guy and it is none of my business. I am more than happy to discuss ministry styles and doctrine. I steer clear of the other things. However, I really want to see how Apostolic oversight is now going to be modeled in this situation. admin note: there was a typo in this line originally that significantly changed the meaning of the sentence.
But you are about 3 months late to the witch hunt. Been in full swing for a while. Which leads me to David
@David - Your #1 point is a major one.
Lesson #3 is pretty big also. A major lesson here is to stay in your realm. We underestimate the ability of high level media people. They can report whatever they want so if you don’t have experience in that area, hire someone who does.
I got my degree from the college of journalism at UF. These media types work around the clock to find something that will sell papers. If you can’t give them what they need they will bury you. Don’t go on national TV and say you can supply something you won’t supply.
There were so many people who were actually healed in Lakeland I truly do not understand how they were unable or unwilling to give evidence. Boggles the mind. I know ministers who have a fraction of the miracles claimed who can give you the phone numbers of people who will testify. And I know there are people from the Lakeland meetings who would have. Why that was not important is perplexing. Maybe that is #2. Who knows.
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Yeah, I was aware of the witch hunt already in progress, I guess I meant more the fact that former “friends and supporters” may turn their backs on Todd and reject everything he and Lakeland are about (the good stuff, I mean). I’m glad to hear Patricia King is calling people to account there, and I too want to see a well run apostolic oversight process. The fact that some well respected guys (Bill Johnson, John Arnott) are involved is encouraging, and I hope can lead to the Lord winning in this situation.
And yes, the Lord takes very seriously those who rejoice in the downfall of others, deserved or not.
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“Telling the truth is not the absence of faith, it is keeping from sin.”
Bingo!
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IT WOULD ALL BE BETTER IF WE WOULD JUST “TOKE THE GHOST” OR BUY BIGGER FLAGS (inside joke that others might not get but Carl’s laughing… Have a great service tonight - I’ll be praying for you)
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