A Question for the Modern Prophetic Movement – What Are You Talking About?
October 30th, 2008 by Carl Thomas.I operate in the prophetic but I am not a prophet and as I look at the modern prophetic movement I sometimes wonder if anyone really is. I could site a million examples but this election season gives a glaring example of what is amiss in this ministry.
The notion that we will get the President we deserve instead of the one we need is patently unbiblical and is founded in false doctrine. And the thought that the final tally of the electoral college will decide God’s dealing with America is a doctrine of demons.
Let me give a little class on prophetic signs. The most senior Senator in Congress, a Republican, was convicted of seven counts of ethics violations exactly a week before the election. This my friends is a prophetic sign. God does judge righteousness but He has a special loathing for hypocrisy. The party that has billed itself as the party of Jesus and family values has truly lost its ways. If you cannot see this you are either blind or a liar. God has even given this sign but the Church, in her pride and self righteousness, will not see it.
I subscribe to the theory of three governments. There is the government of the home, which is lead by the priest of the house. There is the church government which is lead [on earth] by the elders. And there is the civil government which is lead by elected, inherited, or self-appointed leaders. Each is anointed for a specific realm. Each set of leaders will be judged by how they lead the area they have biblical control over. By and large, each is to limit their control to the area they have been appointed to by God.
Ever been in a church when the pastors muck around in family affairs? Ever seen a country where the government exerts control over the church? Ever been a pastor in a church that is run by a few deacons? None of these scenarios work. In fact, I am hard pressed to find good examples of any of them because they are rooted in witchcraft.
But this basic principle is disregarded by the modern church because they would rather exert control by government then take up the God-given responsibility to win the lost and change hearts.
News flash: Born again, spirit-filled, sanctified Christians don’t gamble, get drunk, live their entire lives on welfare and have abortions. Government is not the answer. The answer is a revival of religion in the United Sates. Quit trying to shift our responsibility onto the government.
Under the wicked, christian-murdering government of Rome the Holy Spirit was given and whole nations were turned upside down. Now we are told that if the government is not righteous God will curse the land.
I just got a word, Bible. Crack it open, read what it says. And stop the stupid fear mongering. Jesus has not come back to Judge the earth through a presidential election.
I did receive a prophetic word that actually has the breath of God on it. It did not come from a national book tour prophet. It came from Pastor Theresa Phillips in Chicago. Read it and be blessed:
In worship Wednesday night 29 October /08 I was taken up by the wings of love …far up above the earth, above the America continent.
I ascended being carried by such love and adoration for mankind.
I could feel the gentle touch of the Presence that escorted me beyond the earthly realm.
I was peering down into the earth when I spotted a ring of fire.
It surrounded the White House .
Then it surrounded the city of Washington DC the Capitol and all the Monuments and the ENTIRE CITY
Instantly coming from behind me was a new wind… in this wind was the American bald eagle he was soaring with great strength
He soared past me not one wing flapping in his eyes were blazes of fire.
He was totally focused on Washington DC. in his beak He carried an olive branch .
This eagle soared all across the DC. area and around the White House. He did this several times.
Then he took off and went north… Moving very fast soaring
The wind of the Spirit was in His Wings and he moved not wing he just soared
It went to Russia ,China, Hungary ,Paraguay , South America ,Cuba Hawaii At one point i saw the Dome of the Rock and I saw Him soar over it three times.
And back to the U.S.A . soaring thru the entire country and landed in Washington DC.On the roof of the White House. Where I last saw him perched on the flag pole.
Then…..
The word of the Lord spoke to me
“This olive branch is what I have placed in the mouth of the prophets I place an OLIVE BRANCH IN THE PROPHETS MOUTH America Prophets .
Prophets of America, prophecy rightly in grace and save the world from destruction.
It will be the fire of the prophets who will change the course of a nation . A holy fire !”
“These nations that were circled are where the nations where many prophets are in hiding.
American prophets prophecy to them courage to speak and have grace ”
“Judgment begins in the house of the Lord not on the land of men I will begin to show great discernment in the House of My Children says the Lord!”
“I have not sent judgment I am sending A Prophetic Grace which will speak to MY church so they will love again.”
For through this OLIVE BRANCH will love be extended by the hand of the King Of Kings across the earth
GOD bless the Mouth of the Prophets
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[...] Comment! Update: Link to an interesting post about election prophecies and includes a prophecy [...]
Politics is a very tricky subject to wade into. I’m definitely not one who thinks the church should have no business in the political sphere. I think that’s a mostly American idea promoted by secularists. Yet at the same time, I’m not expecting a Christian takeover of the government. American Policies do have a very significant effect on the church, not just here, but worldwide. Even putting abortion aside (almost impossible to do) Supreme Court justices have a profound effect on every aspect of American life, especially as it relates to proclaiming the Gospel, and discipling the next generation. In the past three presidential elections especially I don’t think there really has been a choice. It’s basically vote for a secularist which will erode our freedom, and advance the wrong causes globally, or vote for the Republican candidate.
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I would disagree that there is a secular party and a godly one. I think God was showing us this with Sen. Stevens’ conviction.
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I live in Pennsylvania, which I think offers a model political climate for the rest of America: pro-lifers are welcome in both the Republican and the Democratic parties. If the national Democratic party had any sense, it would take up the cause of the helpless in the womb and restore its standing with socially conservative working folk. Country club Republicans are not a natural environment for the pro-life movement, it’s more a marriage of convenience rather than conscience. It would be far healthier for America and Christians in America if either party could offer pro-life candidates for national office.
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I’m not arguing that the Republican party is a godly party. I’m arguing that the social and foreign policy implemented by those on the far left, which is the only people nominated by the democratic party for president recently, is dangerous. I have no commitment to the Republican party as such. I am simply a realist about the implications of voting otherwise.
I encourage people who lean democrat to try push for candidates who are socially conservative and who will be strong against radical Islam, and others that want to wipe us, and freedom out. I would vote for them in a heartbeat. I also don’t shed any tears for the Ted Stevens, Mark Foley and Tom Delay’s of the world.
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John Adams said the Constitution was intended to govern a religious people, and was totally unsuitable for governing any other kind. He meant that the Constitution was intended to govern people who are self-disciplined by a healthy fear-reverence of God. Liberty is not the freedom to do whatever one wants, but the freedom to do what is right according to a conscience that is humbled before God.
American used to be a country where this belief functioned. History shows that even in “wild west” towns, there were very few murders or rapes, because even evil people believed that God could see their actions and would repay them according to their deeds. Government was intended to deal only with those who could not restrain themselves (Paul mentioned this as one of government’s God-given roles.)
Now, however, all restraint has been cast off and most people – even many Christians – are functional atheists. Many people and families in America are now used to dealing with government agents on a regular basis: police, probation officers, social workers, etc. It didn’t used to be this way.
This is why even Christians are looking to the government for help and justice, because they no longer believe in divine providence or justice, and do not practice self-restraint/discipline. This nation is expecting, more and more, for discipline and justice to come through the government, rather through God.
As a result, the government has become an idol being worshiped, especially since the government got its hands on huge wealth beginning in 1916 with the introduction of a personal income tax. In the 30s, Roosevelt began to introduce socialism with the government as the “sugar daddy” spreading tax wealth around (i.e., robbing some to pay others).
This socialism has never been repealed or repudiated, and is now accepted by everyone. That’s why Social Security is “the third rail of American politics” – touch it and you die. Even Ronald Reagan didn’t overturn the premise of socialism, though he put a dent in it by cutting back the kinds of things for which Social Security (originally a retirement safety net) funds were being spent, such as chronic alcoholics and other “disabled” people.
Obama is on the verge of election because he’s catering to personal greed by offering to steal more money from richer people (remember, the government has no God-given right to a piece of anyone’s income), and give it to more people who never earned it. This is the Roman “bread and circuses” model: use tax money to hand out favors to as many people as possible, and they will vote you into power, and keep you in power as long as you continue delivering money taken from others.
This was not the intent of the Founding Fathers – in his first inaugural address (1801), Thos. Jefferson stated the accepted belief of his time:
“Still one thing more, fellow-citizens — a wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned.”
He also stated in the same speech that one of the goals of the federal government should be:
“economy in the public expense, that labor may be lightly burthened”
meaning, that the government swhould restrain its spending so that taxation will be light and easy to bear.
Jefferson also stated the belief in a religion that provides “honesty, truth, temperance, gratitude, and the love of man; acknowledging and adoring an overruling Providence…”
Surely our nation has drifted totally away from the foundational beliefs of the Founders, who had disagreements in many things, but not in their belief that men must yield to God and practice his government in their hearts, but not look to political government for many solutions, lest that government tyrannize them.
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October 31st, 2008 at 9:09 am
John Adams was a deist, Jefferson an atheist. There opinions have no bearing on a Christian’s world view. The church has to stop looking to the world for validation and seek the righteousness that comes from hearing God.
Besides, I think history has proven Jefferson wrong on many of the points you quoted, specifically the industrial revolution. But of course the godless are not interested in protecting others, only themselves.
“Obama is on the verge of election because he’s catering to personal greed by offering to steal more money from richer people (remember, the government has no God-given right to a piece of anyone’s income), and give it to more people who never earned it.”
That is pure nonsense. Sorry, Rupert Murdock is not the pope of The Revival Blog.
Since much of the church has lost the sanctifying power of the Holy Ghost they turn to the law to regulate morality. Again, it is only when we stop looking to these godless “heads of state” for a moral compass that we can find the righteousness that comes from a relationship with Jesus.
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Just my humble opinion of course…
I believe that some prophets are caving in to come up with something to say about the election. The words are mixed with flesh big time.
I am with Theresa whole heartedly. The Father God I know is one of grace and mercy. God is love. We need prophecy that may tear down, but build up also.
Don’t give me a fluff n stuff word, gimme the word of the Lord. Don’t add your opinions.
Personally the only word I have gotten in the election is pray and love. Pretty lame, sort of. It all boils down to this anyway.
We will all have to answer to the Lord our choices in life, even this election. If you are satisfied with your justification for a certain candidate, you and you alone will answer for that judgment.
I personally have no party. I vote conscience and God’s ways, if I know them through scripture. This election is pretty cut and dry this way.
God loves us and loves America. Period.
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Go do a little experiment. At your next Christian-political conversation, announce yourself as a pro-life democrat and see how Christians react. I promise you it will not be good.
The secular political right has done such a good job of hijacking the church that Christians have swallowed the lie that those not affiliated with the republican party are somehow unchristian.
I have been a registered republican for quite a while and I have never seen a single person get saved at a republican rally. Never saw someone get baptized in water. Never saw someone filled with the Holy Ghost.
But regardless political affiliation, you still have to call it when people are lying. And there has been a whole bunch of it in politics.
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[...] Absolute truth and genius in that little news flash. I’d recommend everyone check it out here: A Question for the Modern Prophetic Movement – What Are You Talking About? [...]
Hi Cousins
A mangled and probably impertinent comment from the UK!
Just discovered this blog re Grace for Mr Bentley – I applaud your Godly approach folks.
The election of a new President is of course YOUR business but it so affects the rest of us outside your borders as the USA, for now, has the kind of status(?) and influence of Rome or Britain in its heyday. God continue to Bless (& Rebuke) America! God continue to Bless (& Rebuke) England!
The ‘political’ issue that drowns out all others is the Genocide of Infants on every continent – many (most?) pacifists would justify the military force used in WW2 that liberated the Jewish people (mixed historical motives I grant you..).
I don’t endorse reciprocal violence just the fist of the ballot box and prayer mixed with grace and mercy for those personally caught in this dilemma.
That aside, my own personal Prophecy re your Election was spectactularly wrong (as I suspected). And I am so pleased Mr Obama is ‘in’.
So we now have two great healing statements: – a ‘black’ man in the White House, a ‘mixed race’ man in the White House. May God grant him wisdom and integrity…..
Blog on, chaps
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I had a horrible dream where there was a fire inside of the white house, however the whitehouse was a different building–like an apartment complex where many people lived.
Anyway, the president and first lady were on the ground floor, when suddenly there was smoke. They were being whisked away, onto the elevator, to asend up, but the elevator was slow in coming. Other tenants were catching wind of the crises and heading toward the elevator. Panik seemed to grip Barack and his team, as they frantically waited for the elevator. “They’re coming”
one of his team warned him, as the tenants began approaching the elevator, smelling smoke. Just in the nick of time, the door oppened, and Barack and his family were safe in the elevator, ahead of the enquiring crowd.
After arriving on the top floor, Barack began letting others come up with him, onto the top floor, as the fire below was still smoldering.
It became evident that it wasn’t getting put out as quickly as planned, and so, everyone was allowed to join Barack and his team on top.
Once there, the overflowing tenants found the smoke began to move to the top floor. Fire was slowly breaking out! I went down to the middle level, and found a way of escape there. The elevators weren’t working.
Everyone had waited to late to get out! I watched from the distance while people were burning and screaming! It was horrible.
The President was whisked out of the building just in time–help had mysteriously “arrived” for him.
Everyone was released…some were injured, most were okay.
I kept sensing that the entire thing was planned, along with Barack barely escaping along with the masses.
Somehow, I sensed that he was a bit nervous that things were taking so long, so maybe it wasn’t planned.
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